Shop Mobile More Submit  Join Login
×

:iconkibbitzer: More from Kibbitzer


Featured in Collections

Journals by Veni-Scripsi-Vici

Favorite journals by Gingersnap87


More from DeviantArt



Details

Submitted on
February 3, 2013
Link
Thumb

Stats

Views
8,742 (3 today)
Favourites
93 (who?)
Comments
190
×

how to scam an artist... be careful!!!

Journal Entry: Sun Feb 3, 2013, 12:55 PM


I decided to share an article!
it's very important because we are exposed to a threat.

A guide on "how to hire an artist" to take advantage of the innocence of talented artists.
I received many STRANGE requests but I never answered!  
The world has no respect for the members of deviantart!
we are not stupid bitches ಠ_ಠ
I don't know how to comment! read it! SHARE IT here or on facebook
and be careful! Don't underestimate yourself!

>>>> kaitol.com/how-to-hire-an-arti… <<<<


EDIT:
I'm sorry if someone thinks I exaggerated with the title!
maybe I caught too much attention with that, but I don't care
because (beyond the personal opinions)
NOW YOU ARE INFORMED AND YOU WILL BE CAREFUL.

:iconloki-dplz::iconloki-dplz::iconloki-dplz:

------------------------
Journal CSS made by caybeach
Brushes by gvalkyrie
Skin by caybeach (modified by Kibbitzer)
Add a Comment:
 
:iconauroraart:
AuroraArt Featured By Owner Mar 20, 2013  Student Digital Artist
Thanks for sharing this! We artists draw because it's our passion. How dare they try and scam us and make us look like fools! Those heartless people!
Reply
:iconmeanderingknight:
meanderingKnight Featured By Owner Mar 9, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
How ridiculous :|
I can't BELIEVE they are giving tips like this! What, Deviants are just too stupid to realize that they are doing art for what they're worth? Bullshit! Don't abuse starter artists just because you can! That's absurd.
Reply
:iconkhallayne:
Khallayne Featured By Owner Mar 1, 2013
I fail to see how... If the artist is naming their price, and you're agreeing to it, anyone is using anyone.

Especially since sometimes you have a budget and the easiest way to tell by the budget and if you can afford the art is to first ask the artist what they would charge.

I refuse to pay for my art upfront anymore... I've been scammed so often, and I've been left in the dark for months while waiting for a commission.

However, I don't get the tone of the article completely as he is looking down on DA artists, and some of his methods are shady... But if the artist is agreeing on the project and the amount, I fail to see how he's quite doing something wrong.
Reply
:iconscream-stay-night:
Scream-stay-night Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013  Student General Artist
The problem is that he's telling you to only use new artists, people who does not understand how much their art is worth. Sure, that means that you'll end up with a bigger profit in the end, but(as said) a new artist will pretty much always charge way lower than they should. It is still an actual job and the artist should be respected instead of lied to.

It's a question of moral and does and don'ts.
Reply
:iconkhallayne:
Khallayne Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013
Yes, I do get that part, and I do understand that completely. He's going at it from a strictly business man point of view. I'm not saying keep things in the dark about the project, I'd never do that.

And I know more than enough new artists who do not charge as much as their art is worth. At the same time though, an artist did name their price (assuming that they didn't ask for said artist to lower their price even more... That irritates me, especially in a case like this!) and this person is getting the experience that they likely may not have gotten before.

It's not how I do business, and I understand how people view it as a moral part. At the same time, I know projects like these and business transactions as these are what some artists (the very few that I've talked to) have used to boost their own commissioning.

It still comes down that I'm assuming that he's not hassling artists to lower their prices to what he wants, and the artist is making what they wanted to make out of it. Under priced to many of us, but if the other artist comes away happy, and the guy comes away happy. I still don't see any real harm done.
Reply
:iconscream-stay-night:
Scream-stay-night Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013  Student General Artist
I honestly have nothing more to add, cause I agree with you.

Anyway, thanks for sharing your view, I guess I was a bit hasty with the judging..
Reply
:iconkhallayne:
Khallayne Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013
Nonsense. <3 You commented for what you believed in. I think that's important!
Reply
:iconscream-stay-night:
Scream-stay-night Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2013  Student General Artist
I suppose that's true -^^- <3

- thank you
Reply
:iconninjagirl2211:
Ninjagirl2211 Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Wow...
Just...
Wow...
Reply
:iconawolflikeyou:
awolflikeyou Featured By Owner Feb 10, 2013
man, what a douche!
Reply
:iconcidsin:
CidSin Featured By Owner Feb 10, 2013  Hobbyist
whoever wrote this... doesn't think on the other side...
many artists draws and NEVER get their money for their work... even if they hafe to do MORE than what was in the request from the start... *shakes her head*
Reply
:iconandrea--p:
Andrea--P Featured By Owner Feb 9, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Oh my God.. This is just.. So disgusting.. Thanks for posting this!
Reply
:iconhushaby-monster:
hushaby-monster Featured By Owner Feb 7, 2013   Artist
Thank you for posting this! It's really helpful!
Reply
:iconsasuke153:
sasuke153 Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Student General Artist
Say wut?! We are not free/cheap laborers!!!!!
Reply
:iconmanda-j-panda:
manda-j-panda Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Student Digital Artist
Hmmm... I think this person is a moron. I would never do a job like the one they are describing without knowing what it was for. And I would never just hand over all that work BEFORE getting paid... what's going to keep them from just running off with it? :/
Reply
:iconneverstatic:
Neverstatic Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
"Paying after ensures safety for both parties."

...Seriously? How much of an idiot do you have to be before something like this comes out of your mouth? Yes, it's true that people can run away with the money after you paid for some art. But doesn't he understand that theft can work the other way around? A commissioner can run away with your art without paying you! Paying after only ensures the safety of the commissioner. The artist is still at risk.

Yes, businesses must negotiate in order to best satisfy their needs and make a profit, but there is a line that is not to be crossed. Don't be deceitful and withhold information! That should be common sense to anybody. Thank you for sharing. I'll share this as well to keep the word going around.
Reply
:iconindustrialized-hippy:
industrialized-hippy Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Whilst the tone is definitely condescending, I do understand what the author is saying about 'being professional'.
That is: as you are being paid to perform a service, you should respect your employer by being punctual to his/her deadlines, and complete the work paid for to the best of your ability.
Also, you should communicate to your employer in a professional, respectful way if you feel their demands are to much for you.
If you were in any other line of work, the same would be expected of you.

However, that doesn't mean be a doormat either.
As an artist, you should 'shop around'. See what other artists of similar style are charging for their works to get a rough figure at least.
And don't be afraid to barter or bargain.
You are the creator of your works... Don't just sign them away for peanuts, they are worth so much more than that.
Reply
:iconmiguel2010:
Miguel2010 Featured By Owner Feb 5, 2013  Professional Photographer
Thank you for the heads-up. Unfortunately unscrupulous people abound and they will grind anyone into pulp to make paper, in this case, money... sigh... and this, sadly, is how Capitalist societies work. I do appreciate the alert and I will keep my eyes open.
Reply
:icondibbzy:
Dibbzy Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I came across this a few years ago.

How would someone go about hireing an artist? Cause I'm going to start looking for artists for a comic I'm writing at some point, probably soon, and I really have no idea how to go about finding someone/how to deal with them.
Reply
:iconscream-stay-night:
Scream-stay-night Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013  Student General Artist
Well, feel free to look through my stuff if you'd like, but as he said look through DA.

You could look through some of the groups specifically designed for comics: [link] , [link] <-- like these ones. Look through their stuff and send them a note asking if they're interested :33
Reply
:icondibbzy:
Dibbzy Featured By Owner Apr 12, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thank you very much. I'll keep that in mind. :)
Reply
:iconscream-stay-night:
Scream-stay-night Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2013  Student General Artist
you're welcome :)
Reply
:icontheodusa:
theodusa Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Honestly, the guy is right about one thing. Just browse around dA and find someone whose art matches the story type you're trying to write, then contact them to see if they'd be interested. After that it's a matter of paperwork. If you're planning to make money from the comic, you'll need a contract stating percentages of earnings, ability to market, use of the work other than the comic...
Reply
:icondibbzy:
Dibbzy Featured By Owner Feb 11, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thankyou :)
Reply
:iconknoc0ut:
knoc0ut Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student General Artist
I got a job offered to me and they only told me what I will be doing, but they wouldn't tell me anything else. They most definitely kept me in the dark... .___.
Reply
:iconkibbitzer:
Kibbitzer Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student Digital Artist
I don't know if it's normal but it works in this way!
now you are informed and this is the most important thing..
be careful the next time and don't underestimate your work!
Reply
:iconknoc0ut:
knoc0ut Featured By Owner Feb 9, 2013  Student General Artist
yeah, I'll do my best from now on
thank you for the post!
Reply
:iconstudlyfudd13:
Studlyfudd13 Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I like the background to this journal
Reply
:iconprofanity00:
Profanity00 Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013
Omg... I will absolutely share this.
Reply
:icondragondarkfire:
DragonDarkFire Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013   Traditional Artist
ok that's screwed up. i mean i can maybe justify not paying someone with no experience as much as someone who is a professional. that's how all work is. but to pay them a mere ten percent? if that? no. that's fucked up. thats their work and their time.
Reply
:iconblueykatt:
BlueyKatt Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
.....SON OF A------

....ughhhhhhh. I am NOT happy right now ಠ_ಠ

Thank you Kibbitzer, for showing us this.
Reply
:iconkibbitzer:
Kibbitzer Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student Digital Artist
now you know how it works!
it doesn't matter if it's right or wrong... the danger is everywhere!
just be careful and everything will be ok!
not everybody are scammers XD
Reply
:iconblueykatt:
BlueyKatt Featured By Owner Feb 7, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Thank god for that! XD
Reply
:iconillustica:
illustica Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
thanks for sharing this. I have received shady requests as well, but I never reply to requests unless I asked somewhere. I was insulted with the article. I know the person is just trying to help others find artists to commission, but what does he think of us? We're not stupid. I'm not stupid. We know pretty damn well how to organize our own commissions. He talked about us as if we're noob artists. It's just....disgusting.

Oh well.
Reply
:iconviralremix:
viralremix Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013
That's not a guide on how to scam an artist. Come on, read the article. Business work that way. Looking for the cheapest labor isn't a bad thing, and no one's being FORCED to work for low pay. Business will ALWAYS go for the cheapest bid on a project. That's just a fact. Look at how the government does contract work bids for instance.

And honestly? As the owner of a business, artists have scammed me PLENTY of times when I pay them first, or just delivered in a time frame that's unacceptable and was defined as unacceptable from the start. I pay them, set a reasonable deadline (say, one month) and they take 6months to finish the work. Sometimes they take a year. Sometimes just don't do the work at all, despite multiple (reasonably timed) emails requesting an update. Just take the money and run.

Fortunately we live in a world where PayPal protects us from people taking money and running, but that DOESN'T work when PayPal won't protect you 60 days past the payment. So if an artist takes the money up front, then takes more than 60 days to do the work? You're shit out of luck. You can't get your money back.
Reply
:iconkibbitzer:
Kibbitzer Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student Digital Artist
many people don't know how it works!
I'm sharing this article to inform the people about the mentality behind the business and avoid unpleasant situations.
who wrote those things is not the real problem but there are many dishonest motherfuckers!

you just need to be informed and CAREFUL and everything will be ok!
Share it! beyond the personal opinions...
Reply
:iconviralremix:
viralremix Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013
There are plenty of business people and plenty of artists like that too. But what exactly in that article are you warning against? Why is it necessary to warn them at all? If anything, educate people to raise their prices according to the hours put in. That'd be a reasonable action, not attack someone for sharing that low prices can be found here on DA. That's like attacking someone for telling other businesspeople to hire labor in China instead.
Reply
:iconsnokkedoedel:
snokkedoedel Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
He sure says our art is "the best" but I don't like the "cheapest" part, and the "keep them in the dark" part I dislike the most. It makes me sad :(
Reply
:iconlimro:
Limro Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Now, I only read the original article - what is the problem?
Pay after a job is done... That's normal for a service, right?

I have never gone to a restaurant and paid first and then had the meal.
If you don't like what you get it would be "bad luck" and the money is lost... That doesn't work that well.

If you want to be paid in advance make a preview in sloppy quality and say 'money first - then good quality'.
Reply
:iconkibbitzer:
Kibbitzer Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student Digital Artist
many people don't know how it works..
I'm sharing this article to inform the people about the mentality behind the business and avoid unpleasant situations.
who wrote those things is not the real problem but there are many dishonest motherfuckers!

you just need to be informed and CAREFUL and everything will be ok!
Share it! beyond the personal opinions... I'm just worried ಡ-ಡ /

(and btw! where I live in many restaurants/bars you have pay BEFORE XD)
Reply
:iconlimro:
Limro Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Pay for food up front - hm...
Oh well. I'll take care should anyone contact me.

Thanks for the heads up :)
Reply
:iconrb-illustration:
RB-Illustration Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013   Digital Artist
I've read this before, it made me so angry. .___. You're right, he should just rename it 'how to scam an artist' and be done with it. With advice like this floating around, it's no wonder so many people expect commissions to be done at rock-bottom prices and for artists to accept the payment after they're done. How can he honestly insist that payment afterwards is safe for both parties involved? This article is so condescending it just... UGH. >:I
Reply
:iconnomnomkakashi:
NomnomKakashi Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student General Artist
It is upsetting for people to think that this site it just for cheap work. But the artists who are having to be careful are those amazing ones whose work is perfect, it doesnt really matter to me and such who is still trying to perfect it. But still thankyou
Reply
:iconajkidzia:
Ajkidzia Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
What A Son Of A Bitch! [He Should Be Closed In Dark Place (basement or something...)]
Thanks For Showing This. I'll Send It To Friends. Also non-artistic Ones
Reply
:iconsharaiza:
Sharaiza Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Senza parole...
Reply
:iconmargot-san:
Margot-san Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013
I think that you should write an article about such theories and ways and post it here, on devart. It is something that should be brought to attention and articles can be "faved" and thus spread more widely.
Reply
:icondoretetsu:
Doretetsu Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Student Filmographer
I can understand that they just want to make profit just like we artist want to do some too.
But the way he wants hiring people to act is just totally abject.
Because he wants to use artists for professional purposes, want them to act like professionals like respecting a deadline and getting paid at the end BUT without considering them as professional.I'm sorry but that's totally unfair.
Damn i read some comments, yes artists should be just careful about that kind of people and just make worthy price in order to not get scamed.
But what about people who doesn't know anything about the price they should apply ?
And OF COURSE, the fact that you can be more clever than they are doesn't mean that this people way of thinking is RIGHT.
Anyway now that article should be shared on deviant art and the 'DA artists are cheaper' won't work anymore. They are limits to how dumb they think we are.
Reply
:iconaeris85:
Aeris85 Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Reading the original article, it surely DOES sound a little mean and so. The apology makes it slightly better.
However - I don't earn my money through art, I'm a Game Designer, so I would probably stand on his side, regarding the roles - however, everyone that really works and makes a living with his art here on deviantART should KNOW that when you want to hire someone, you look for the cheapest with the best quality! Everything else would be naive.

Nobody can tell me that they spend their own earned money on too expensive services or donate more than they have to.

Moreover, the article writer didn't say "And then I offer them 50% less of money than what I expect it to cost." NO. He said "I ask them what they need / think their service is worth".
Imagine to be hiring someone else for a service that YOU can't do: Would you ever say: "Oh, that's not very much, would you mind if I gave you 1,000$ more?"

So please think about that before you judge his hiring process.
Reply
:iconheartoffiresoulofice:
HeartOfFireSoulOfIce Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
They wrote an apology, which made things a little better.

However, the TONE. It irks me so MUCH! It sort of sounds like a smug person who earned shittons of money doing this.

But then again, I see where they're coming from. Next time I'll DEFINITELY make sure I negotiate the price I think they should be.
Reply
:iconaeris85:
Aeris85 Featured By Owner Feb 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
*nod* I agree with you. When negotiating, you should mention a higher price than you think you could get. If the other person REALLY wants your service, then he won't let you go and he'll make a counter offer, and you can rethink about it and judge if it's worth it.

From there on, it's just your choice to do it or leave it.
Reply
Add a Comment: